Zerg Basics

[Rippo]

I was just wondering what your zerg basics are?

1) Do you choke up every game, mass drones for first 2-4 mins + making 10 hatches or so

OR

2) Fast Tech risking death with no choke?

I need to work on my zerg, and I would like to hear from zerg experts on how they build and adapt. I already know that the high apm is because of hotkeys/micro... and u need hotkeys to control ur mass and everything.

But do you guys hotkey some random hatches to help unit production or do u just hold down ctrl and click on a larva to make units?

[Opi]

ummm....well i'm not a "zerg expert" but i do basically what warlord tells me to do....and thats mass drones first 2-4 min, but i usually dont choke unless i find out they're terran pretty early, because if i choke, i am vunerable to early zealots, since they can just run past. :( :(

and if they're a smart terran, they will just drop tanks behind my choke. :(

and theres really no point to chokes when its ZvZ.

[Rippo]

When would you start building dra's n them if you wanna mass up good? ( At what drone psi? ) like 30/30? or 40/40?

[Funky]

i make drones, 2 hatches, with spaces inbetween, put sunkens in between and put them everywhere, it helps alot, i make spores in back for drops.. but just 2, and put some hydras there.. oh yeah i make hydras and put them at choke and all my sunkens are inbetween my hatches, ill show a rep later.

[Opi]

When would you start building dra's n them if you wanna mass up good? ( At what drone psi? ) like 30/30? or 40/40?
i usually do it at about 35 supply, unless its ZvT, then i go fast tech w/ or w/out choke. :)

[pen]

i think instead of getting all minerals first, then gas it's smarter to get a little bit of each early enough. i usually go 2 hatch pool, two more hatches (and some sunkens depending on situation, if it's bad, only 1 extra hatchery after pool cuz of money spent on sunks). i then get gas. and depending on wut i feel like, either hydras or mutas.not sure wut the psi count is when i get gas but it's probably around 25~29 psi. then slowly keep harassing the opponent while you build up and get men at ur main. it works fine to me. the timings seem to scare ppl

[darkkefu]

I was just wondering what your zerg basics are?

1) Do you choke up every game, mass drones for first 2-4 mins + making 10 hatches or so

OR

2) Fast Tech risking death with no choke?

I need to work on my zerg, and I would like to hear from zerg experts on how they build and adapt. I already know that the high apm is because of hotkeys/micro... and u need hotkeys to control ur mass and everything.

But do you guys hotkey some random hatches to help unit production or do u just hold down ctrl and click on a larva to make units?
Early game hotkeys

Late game ctrl or double click

[PrEdAtOr]

I go 4 hatch pool,and always pulled it off. Then, i pull off some sunks if it's a 1v1 with some zlings and if it's not,then i just max drones/hatches. like 16 hatcheries and 50 drones on mins and 18 on vesp.Then i do the usual units and shit.

[StarZ]

I've grown to choke pretty much every game because I'm a big newbie. Zealot rushes dont really phase me unless they're accompanied by probes, *and* if they scouted me really early. I actually stick to making tons and tons of drones before I make any hydras, and only make lings for scouting purposes. The awesome thing about zerg is that you can go from having no army to having an army of 50 or so supply in under a minute, so by knowing exactly what the enemy is going and seeing before hand when they start coming to attack, you're able to work on economy instead of wasting money and early time on hydras or whatever, slowing down your economy. If you're afraid of a temp drop early on or something, of course hydras are ok, but I rely more on killing the enemy with as little units as possible so I can just keep making drones. Within a few minutes you'll have 50 of them on minerals, and then any newbie could just pump and pump until the enemy is gone.
The hard but fun stuff comes into play when you play someone who rushes incredibly fast and makes you have to work at it, or does "unique" strats. And, the hard but lame stuff comes when they just temp drop or reaver drop you all game. -.-;

[God Emperor Uber]

Don't choke, if you want d, just d up around your immediate area, I usually go fast tech and it seems to win

[Opi]

but sometimes choking is a bad idea....vs a good terran they will drop tanks behind you're choke, and then.....well.....you're screwed! (early on i mean)

and in zvp's if u choke they will see it when they scout and will send zealots instantly, who will run past you're choke and take your main. :( :(

[Trojan]

I get some lings (12-24) while i'm massing drones along with sunkens (2-6) around my base at random spots, to help with the D. I also change my strats depending on location. If i cant find them with an ovie at the first 4 bases, i figure i have a lil more time. Works more often than not.

[Byakuya]

Lings really do help, even if its just 4 or 5 added in with your sunkens, it helps draw the zealots/rines fire while the sunkens do the big damage.

[BathingApe]

i usually jus get a 3/4 sunks and get about 10/12 lings for d ..then i mass drones till i get about 10 hatchs then mass hydras :D

[E = MC²]

i dont think u should go straight tech because 1) zergs strength is its ability to mass and 2) theres no lurkers in orig ;( i used to NEVER choke tvz (on BW) and instead go 2-3 hatch then tech to lurks. also i sometimes get fast hydras (like 20) and scatter them around my base to protect drones from money rapes, then i go back to massing drones and making hatch etc.

[Smooth]

The key I usually find that makes or breaks whether I win or lose with Zerg is my start. If the enemy gives you enough time to tech, even just a little ahead of them, the game is pretty much yours.

My first tip is
For the first 2-3 minutes, moniter like CRAZY. Make a drone as SOON as you hit 50 minerals, and send them to build/mine as SOON as they spawn. Also, when they hit 9/9 at beggining, instead of going overlord, use a drone to build an extractor, and then it brings psi back down to 8/9. Start build for drone, and then cancel extractor, and send the drone who was going extractor to do whatever. That little trick can be used 2-3 times at start to pick up a little time.

In my opinion, the most important thing for Zerg is the first 2-3 minutes. If you can get off to a good start, it is usually pretty hard to stop.

[StarZ]

but sometimes choking is a bad idea....vs a good terran they will drop tanks behind you're choke, and then.....well.....you're screwed! (early on i mean)

and in zvp's if u choke they will see it when they scout and will send zealots instantly, who will run past you're choke and take your main. :( :(

The chances of someone teching straight to a tank drop are seriously astronomical unless he scouts you like immediately. Most people wont try a tank drop because when it fails (and yes, it does fail in almost every case in vs. a good zerg player), they are so far behind that they cant stop a counter. It's better to just tech up to tanks for the sunkens up front and build as usual, because if you go 1 barracks, 1 factory, 1 starport and try to drop, any newb could send 12 zerglings into your base after the drop and beat you >.<
And, as far as zealots going in to take the main, it's impossible to have that many zealots early on get through the sunkens unhurt enough to do any real damage; even drones can mop up the few severely hurt zealots that break through. And, even 1 sunken added at the main will ensure that a rush like that doesn't work.

']The key I usually find that makes or breaks whether I win or lose with Zerg is my start. If the enemy gives you enough time to tech, even just a little ahead of them, the game is pretty much yours.

My first tip is
For the first 2-3 minutes, moniter like CRAZY. Make a drone as SOON as you hit 50 minerals, and send them to build/mine as SOON as they spawn. Also, when they hit 9/9 at beggining, instead of going overlord, use a drone to build an extractor, and then it brings psi back down to 8/9. Start build for drone, and then cancel extractor, and send the drone who was going extractor to do whatever. That little trick can be used 2-3 times at start to pick up a little time.

In my opinion, the most important thing for Zerg is the first 2-3 minutes. If you can get off to a good start, it is usually pretty hard to stop.

In all honesty, it doesn't make that big of a difference if you make a drone 0.1 seconds too late, you make it sound like that makes or breaks the game. If you think about it, that difference of 1 drone being there half a second early makes about a 2 mineral difference overall in the *entire* game. Yes the start is the most important part of a zerg player, but thats because they are so vulnerable and have to rely on jumping ahead of other races in economy to provide a real threat. Instead of wasting energy on counting down miliseconds until drones are done, plan ahead to what you'll be building and use the energy to micro and save units if you're rushed.. it'll be much more cost-effective.

[Jem]

I've grown to choke pretty much every game because I'm a big newbie. Zealot rushes dont really phase me unless they're accompanied by probes, *and* if they scouted me really early. I actually stick to making tons and tons of drones before I make any hydras, and only make lings for scouting purposes. The awesome thing about zerg is that you can go from having no army to having an army of 50 or so supply in under a minute, so by knowing exactly what the enemy is going and seeing before hand when they start coming to attack, you're able to work on economy instead of wasting money and early time on hydras or whatever, slowing down your economy. If you're afraid of a temp drop early on or something, of course hydras are ok, but I rely more on killing the enemy with as little units as possible so I can just keep making drones. Within a few minutes you'll have 50 of them on minerals, and then any newbie could just pump and pump until the enemy is gone.
The hard but fun stuff comes into play when you play someone who rushes incredibly fast and makes you have to work at it, or does "unique" strats. And, the hard but lame stuff comes when they just temp drop or reaver drop you all game. -.-;
See, I don't find that strat works very well vs early toss scout + 1 nexus. Zeals just walk past the choke before 1 sunk is ready. :(

And in the case of an eary T scout, you've got a bunker net to your hatch.

[eNtitY~]

I've grown to choke pretty much every game because I'm a big newbie. Zealot rushes dont really phase me unless they're accompanied by probes, *and* if they scouted me really early. I actually stick to making tons and tons of drones before I make any hydras, and only make lings for scouting purposes. The awesome thing about zerg is that you can go from having no army to having an army of 50 or so supply in under a minute, so by knowing exactly what the enemy is going and seeing before hand when they start coming to attack, you're able to work on economy instead of wasting money and early time on hydras or whatever, slowing down your economy. If you're afraid of a temp drop early on or something, of course hydras are ok, but I rely more on killing the enemy with as little units as possible so I can just keep making drones. Within a few minutes you'll have 50 of them on minerals, and then any newbie could just pump and pump until the enemy is gone.
The hard but fun stuff comes into play when you play someone who rushes incredibly fast and makes you have to work at it, or does "unique" strats. And, the hard but lame stuff comes when they just temp drop or reaver drop you all game. -.-;
When i did that to you PvZ you handle it very well.

[Smooth]

In all honesty, it doesn't make that big of a difference if you make a drone 0.1 seconds too late, you make it sound like that makes or breaks the game. If you think about it, that difference of 1 drone being there half a second early makes about a 2 mineral difference overall in the *entire* game. Yes the start is the most important part of a zerg player, but thats because they are so vulnerable and have to rely on jumping ahead of other races in economy to provide a real threat. Instead of wasting energy on counting down miliseconds until drones are done, plan ahead to what you'll be building and use the energy to micro and save units if you're rushed.. it'll be much more cost-effective.
The thing is you should already have a plan as to what you want to do. Also, in the first 2-3 minutes of the game the chances of getting attacked are relatively low. Sometimes it happens, but not often. So tell me, why would you be thinking about micro and saving units in the beggining when the chances of being rushed first 2-3 minutes are what? One out of ten times?

[StarZ]

See, I don't find that strat works very well vs early toss scout + 1 nexus. Zeals just walk past the choke before 1 sunk is ready. :(

And in the case of an eary T scout, you've got a bunker net to your hatch.
I honestly cant remember ever losing to a protoss rusher who ran past my choke. The only times I can remember losing ZvP to a rush is when someone (i totally forgot who, it's someone on this site tho) rushed my choke that had a hatch, sunk, and a creep turning into a sunk with a couple zealots and like 6 probes. He managed to kill my choke but instead of running to my back to my drones (where I had 2 creeps morphing into sunks already since it took him so long), he decided to start building cannons and kill my hatches, then eventually he went on to put robotics facilities and gateways in my base.
Oh lol, I just remembered who it was... bloodstalkers, on our first 1v1 ever; that was a looong time ago! Even before he joined sifu.. dang.. Yeah, well I beat him 2-0 ZvP after that :D I just didn't expect the rush, I found out of course after that that is his specialty.. zealot/cannon rushing >.< PUNK!

When i did that to you PvZ you handle it very well.
Thank you =) Maybe if I can find that rep I'll post it for reference, that was a good game, and our only 1v1! *cries*

']The thing is you should already have a plan as to what you want to do. Also, in the first 2-3 minutes of the game the chances of getting attacked are relatively low. Sometimes it happens, but not often. So tell me, why would you be thinking about micro and saving units in the beggining when the chances of being rushed first 2-3 minutes are what? One out of ten times?
Losing one out of ten times for me is unacceptable ;) Especially if it's over the same problem. I also prefer to play "relaxed" (which is hard when I play people from this site -.-;;), and if I'm freaking out over how many miliseconds there are left until the drone is done, I might pop a blood vessel x.x

[Jem]

Vero you've seen Stalife's strat in Pv......usually Z, right? The zeals come out so fast that it's actually too quick for the zerg to defend against. And that's without hatching our front.

Now obviously if you decide to choke as a zerg, you would be even slower than the standard build. But otherwise I'd agree, not every toss player plays the same.

Anyways I've added a PvZ I played in euro. No doubt that you could handle yourself better as a zergy ;) .

[Anjo]

i choke only if im vs random and i think he is a good terran player..if not i dont choke because it slows you ...i pull the hatch build until i think its too risky and than i start to pump hydraz

[Byakuya]

I usually only choke with zerg vs a good ran. If they random I will usually take the chance that they got zerg or toss, and if I find out they are ran I will just build more sunkens in front of hatcheries and get some ling/hydra to take the dmg and support the sunks till I can get a hydra army.

[NeSS]

The most effective way of zerg is for a zvp.. Make a whole line of hatches then make 2 more all the way 2 left or right. build 3 sunks and unit place your men so you can make an easy counter.. Saw it in a pvz ToTeM vs MonGo

[Jem]

I usually only choke with zerg vs a good ran. If they random I will usually take the chance that they got zerg or toss, and if I find out they are ran I will just build more sunkens in front of hatcheries and get some ling/hydra to take the dmg and support the sunks till I can get a hydra army.
Even vs a terran I think it could be risky. That's when a fast scout really determines who has the initial upper hand...

[StarZ]

When i did that to you PvZ you handle it very well.
Yeah, this game was a very gg; you almost had me- and managed to build stuff inside my base. I was pretty worried.. eeeeeek!

Vero you've seen Stalife's strat in Pv......usually Z, right? The zeals come out so fast that it's actually too quick for the zerg to defend against. And that's without hatching our front.

Now obviously if you decide to choke as a zerg, you would be even slower than the standard build. But otherwise I'd agree, not every toss player plays the same.

Anyways I've added a PvZ I played in euro. No doubt that you could handle yourself better as a zergy ;) .

I seriously forgot I played Stalife ZvP while I was in WesT), and I didn't realize he did his "middle build" strat, and did pretty much what you just said was impossible to stop :p Darn gg, a match of quality of units over quantity ^.^

Btw Entity and Stalife are 2 of my favorite people I've 1v1'd.. so gm :)
LOL, and if you have PP, use it on the game of me vs. stalife.. he tries mind tricks on me when I think he's going to reaver drop on me!

[StarZ]

I usually only choke with zerg vs a good ran. If they random I will usually take the chance that they got zerg or toss, and if I find out they are ran I will just build more sunkens in front of hatcheries and get some ling/hydra to take the dmg and support the sunks till I can get a hydra army.
Yeah but even protoss players today sometimes put cannons at the front of your base. I once lost to some no name player in Demigod VERY badly, I didn't choke in the front and I didn't put sunkens in front of my hatches (i did it behind, in case of a mineral rush), and he just walks in with zealots and probes, builds cannons that can reach my hatcheries, and I didn't put up any kind of decent fight because I was freaking out. He laughed and called me a newb.. after I cried and called myself a newb >.<

The most effective way of zerg is for a zvp.. Make a whole line of hatches then make 2 more all the way 2 left or right. build 3 sunks and unit place your men so you can make an easy counter.. Saw it in a pvz ToTeM vs MonGo
Post a replay!

Even vs a terran I think it could be risky. That's when a fast scout really determines who has the initial upper hand...

*ahem*
Replays attached ;)
I also, just for fun, attached a replay of bishop raping me ZvT in the EvW tourny with a rush... evil evil evil evil evil .... =P

[Dr.Lag]

ummm....well i'm not a "zerg expert" but i do basically what warlord tells me to do....and thats mass drones first 2-4 min, but i usually dont choke unless i find out they're terran pretty early, because if i choke, i am vunerable to early zealots, since they can just run past. :( :(

and if they're a smart terran, they will just drop tanks behind my choke. :(

and theres really no point to chokes when its ZvZ.6 zerglings (150$) and one sunken can take 5 or 6 zealots if used right

[Dr.Lag]

Vero you've seen Stalife's strat in Pv......usually Z, right? The zeals come out so fast that it's actually too quick for the zerg to defend against. And that's without hatching our front.

Now obviously if you decide to choke as a zerg, you would be even slower than the standard build. But otherwise I'd agree, not every toss player plays the same.

Anyways I've added a PvZ I played in euro. No doubt that you could handle yourself better as a zergy ;) . I got lucky zvp vs him once :) i sometimes use his strat too, it works extremely well

[rine.x[lw]]

I believe my zerg build is sexier then most.... I would tell it, but then people would use it, and people would learn to coutner it. Basics of it. Quick tech, not to advanced units, but to advanced upgrades. With mass units... Good game, Thanks....